CSC Minutes 10/18/97

Meeting Time 10:00AM- 2:00PM

Location: Bill McAvinney's & Carolyn Fuller's in Cambridge

Attendance: Bill Bassett, Anne Moss (1st half facilitator), Bill McAvinney, Dena Gartenstein, David Kahn (time keeper), Margaret Flinter, Paul Freundlich (2nd half facilitator), Carolyn Fuller (note taker)

Agenda:

Check Ins [5 min.]

REPORTS

1. Updates on potential sites [15 min.]

Bill McCarthy had been told by reps that he would get instructions from CSC. He was waiting to hear from us. Reps didn't let CSC know that we were directing Bill McCarthy's actions. Mataponi wants decision by early November. Bill McCarthy will be talking to Mataponi about the new rec. hall. Will it be built? $25,000 is worth it *if* rec. hall is built.

1. Kinderland - no new info hasn't been visited because of Jewish holidays and how busy Bill McCarthy was. Paul, Margaret & Anne can visit. If it looks good, they will suggest that Bill McCarthy should visit. Anne will try to set appointment. They will aim for this Thursday or Friday.
2. Camp Vega - new rental in ME - Bill McCarthy - basic phone info - Ed Trenner suggested but Bill McCarthy hasn't been able to contact the owners by phone. They are traveling. Impression from talking with Ed: Owner is former worker for Ed. Echo Lake in Kent's Hill, ME. near Augusta. More secluded. Currently paying Mataponi $20,000-$25,000. Ed's response to this fact was that Camp Vega was a VERY nice site. This statement put red flags up for Bill McCarthy - perhaps they want too much money. Further north - too far for folks to travel? Biggest concern is that Bill McCarthy thinks that $ will be too high. Augusta is real far north.
3. c) Camp Chia - update - Paul/Margaret 120 acres close to reservoir abuts state land. not much traffic. across the street is property. we could plant trees or build fence to ensure privacy. Margaret felt like it could be protected. Some trees there. Where road is level no problem. But where road curves up might be a problem but further away from water. Mrs. Wainwright owns property. Rabbi bought this camp, some fixing but never opened? He never made a payment outside of down payment. He never paid taxes. $420,000 - 430,000 would clear books. Some other people are interested. He wants at least 450,000 will auction - will take bids. Last assessment was $600,000. A lot of land in a central area. Pond is small but sufficient for us. We could paddle around and swim. Compared to Omni across to far shore but nothing beyond out maybe a football field. A huge town lake about an 1/8 mile away for folks who want boating, etc. Camp is private with one part of pond exposed to road would need privacy work. 11 or 12 buildings. Can't get on it until they foreclose. Lawyer is assuming that the Rabbi will walk away. No response from them. In 60 days this will be up for bids. Pictures need to be taken. Somehow we need to get a look at the buildings. Margaret says let's call town hall to ask them how close we can get for photos. If we can't get close enough let's ask them to call us as soon as it is foreclosed. Let's find out as much as we can from Mrs. Wainwright. If this looks exciting, show pictures at Boston weekend, have meeting. If folks are interested then we need a pool of people who would go to auction. Call Tom Boynton (Friends and Lovers) to see if they are interest. How ready are Friends and Lovers to move? Anne Moss says they are ready. We found this site because there was an article in a paper. The article says there were septic problems. We should be aware of this.
4. d) Camp Connection (the brokers) - Bill McAvinney - Hasn't returned phone call that Bill McAvinney made Thursday
5. e) Other ?

2. Update from Anne on the DNE Resource Project [10 min.]

Camilla hasn't gotten back to Anne but insert in Alphonse.

DISCUSSIONS

1. Review site spec sheet Margaret is working on. [15 min.]

see attached. Some discussion about whether adequate parking needed to be put into major amenities or non-essential. Margaret felt it would be intimidating to put it into major - compromise ? Should $500,000 be in there? Margaret feels that it is necessary in order to establish our credibility. Was $500,000 in minutes from summer camp '96? Kitchen... major plus or critical? Can build so major plus. Why are people buying a camp? This would bother any zoning boards. But it wouldn't bother Realtors. Bill Bassett is willing to take Neil Cowan's place if Neil is dropping out as core.

2. Planning the weekend

Anne's parting words - important to have people from all view points at this weekend. People who feel strongly that we shouldn't buy. People who feel strongly that we should buy. Extreme view points important. Need to do lot's of out reach to these people.

a) go around about intentions [20 min.]

--have everyone share what they hope to accomplish at a weekend--no dialoguing, just sharing our own thoughts. (perhaps we could share our biggest hopes for what could possibly happen at the weekend)

--D.K. Talking about buying Chia but it's like children playing not being practical because DNE can't really reach consensus on this. This discussion needs to be brought out to larger community. How do you feel about purchase. We need to really get it out there. So we aren't railroading anything. Should DNE drop out and allow another group to buy and we rent from them?

--M.F. Discussion about DNE buying or another group - create a cooperative ownership structure with DNE over 50% share - HMO structure in CT. Good for responding to concerns spoken at last meeting.

--B.B. Concerns from last meeting - proposal good way to start. Important - board range of possible structures - can't generate all the possibilities that might work - how can some kind of structure be created that would be attractive to investors? Form for generating ideas about different kinds of structures that would satisfy everyone involved.

--B.M. Bring conversation out of hypothetical to concrete - one to 3 proposals - hypothetical site described (might or might not exist) out right buy, something like what Margaret described, one that David described. Weekend spent hashing through these proposals. It will highlight our differences and allow us to deal with them. Having gone through this process will make it easier in future. People won't be as frightened when it is hypothetical. Place/vibes sub-committee - important to incorporate our sense of community - have people with skills in ritual on the schedule.

--D.G. rather than take specific proposals - broadened discussions, wider community, less work related folks, larger community. Living as community for weekend. Still focused on living as community. Clarifying question - Broadening discussion - getting more people? Three ideas - let's work at developing 5 more - let's broaden the ideas we have.

--P.F. wants to got o Bill's meeting not Dena's - had wonderful home place meetings. Played a lot extra. I want the kind of meeting that focuses on strategy. Goals decided. How are we approaching this. Bill's formula is good. I don't want to broaden the ideas. It's time to focus to get this thing right. What do we do with it? We've talked for 5 years (home place). Someday we will get something. It won't be perfect it will be a compromise. No more generalized discussions. Some play involved. People from other groups involved (e.g., Friends and Lovers) to do reality checking? People investing money - they should be there. Create a 2nd mortgage, cooperative mortgage - ownership is not in mortgage - but security is in mortgage.

C.F. - I want to see the focus of proposals. I don't want to broadened the ideas - I want to be able to answer some specific questions at the end of the weekend.

D.D. - We are becoming insular - We are cutting off the ideas. We are not bringing the rest of the community along. There is a piece missing where we are and where the community is.

M.F. - Don't feel the disjointed - or insular - We had specific charges from community meeting '96. May not be comfortable but it is where we are operating.

P.F. - Organism gets confused - very nice but like muppit - had on its mind "Buying, Buying" last summer "membership, membership" - has this group been separated from this muppit?

B.M. - Go out find specific sites - but community not solidly behind this. This weekend is to find out what the community is solidly behind. I don't see that we have A,B,C proposal and a decision will be made behind one of those proposals. I see that we will get a feel for what direction the community wants to go. Structure the proposals so that they are a broad enough range that includes everyone in discussion. We aren't deciding A,B. or C - work from proposals - half want A and half want C+ - or we all end up with F -

D.G. - part of what I'm responding to is Paul's proposal from last meeting. Suddenly we had to either go with Paul's proposal or ...Hey, there are other possibilities.

P.F. - Bill McAvinney & I had a discussion around mortgage - different idea - but workable - came out of my proposal. This is what we've worked through. Here is the structure.

B.B. - I don't hear conflict - slight different between start with proposals or not start with proposals. We don't have to narrow down from positions. I would like to see us produce a decision tree that spells out the various options. People who have not been part of this process are afraid that their opinion will not be heard. Huge decision tree - ideas/ all options incorporated into the decision tree.

D.K. - Specific proposals to work on - come away with best results - focus us. Less time spent figuring out what to talk about. Brainstorming productive also. We have gone through the first part already not completely but somewhat. We will be more productive to move to second. We aren't closed to ideas but this particular meeting would be most productive on focus with our being open to new idea that emerges from derivative.,

C.F. P.F. M.F. - vision quest from '96 summer camp - notes should be required meeting. Should it be organized ahead of time or not? organize ahead of time but go back all the way back to first community meeting about home place. Margaret will bring together these notes and minutes and organize. B.B. and D.K. will work with M.F.

P.F. - 3 scenarios - a lot of stuff not dealt with ahead of time. I want people who have really thought about this stuff. Ask people for a 1 page response to what does all this mean? we enforce a level of cooperation on being prepared. frustrated about camp Chia - weekend will be in Feb. Involved in the buying of property in Nov? Will we be hanged? Another possibility - weekend focuses on what do we do with property that we've already purchased? Things that have t be done 60 days from now. Are we ready?

D.G. - What's happening community meeting? Membership

P.F. - hard to keep together because we are a blob - because we don't live together

C.F. - can we use as a scenario proposal - hypothetical - can we use as a learning scenario.

B.M. - doesn't need to be real - or it can be a real possibility - easier if real like.

M.F. don't think things move that fast. We could follow possibilities with understanding that a community meeting would have to be called for a final decision. - have a few minutes at Boston weekend.

D.K. - like? What steps - reps could theoretically buy the land - but wouldn't without community commenting. no meeting until summer time. How could we as an organization buy a piece of land? Therefore, it is an impossibility for DNE to buy. not another related organization.

P.F. - 3 ways it could happen - 1) after looking at it - we find out that buildings in good shape, septic OK, privacy OK, fantastic, partnership folks like it - reps call community meeting - 2) we poll a delegation - post card everyone on mailing list - vote - We will go with 80% range - not looking for 51% vote - substantial vote in the community. 3) reps say that we like property but we can't buy right now but we will sign long term rental. - less feasible.

D.G. - are reps empowered to call a community meeting? Not in by-laws - they can't add a dance. The only thing that the community meeting does is add member dances according to by-laws. The reps can decide what they want. Who's going to give us $400,000?

P.F. - The financial package needs to work out. We'd have to prove we could pay mortgage. Not a show stopper.

B.M. - We don't look all that flaky. We look reasonably stable. A lot of banks don't lend to non-profits. VT National Bank, community development lend.

P.F. - people within community will secure loan. It is doable. If we didn't have $100,000 in cash it would not be doable.

b) brainstorming [20 min]

c) discussion of weekend's general contents [30 min]

-- a continuation of above as a discussion

<--- Lunch Break [30 min] ---->

d) tentative broad agenda for the weekend [40 min]

--more practical planning, what ideas sound good, what don't

move to specific task

e) set a date (or range) [10 min]

Feb. or Mar. - Paul F. will post possible dates on DNESrch.

f) specifics: [30 min]

all tasks will be substantially completed by Boston weekend

--what are the tasks that need doing? who's going to do them?

--agenda

P.F., Dena, B.M. will build an agenda and post to DNESrch

B.M. will put together first draft of agenda B.M. will ask ALisa if she will help

--space

P.F. will check out

--food

P.F.

--budget

D.G.

--getting the word out

C.F.

--play/vibes

Ask ALisa if she will do this?

--registration

D.G.

--timeline

What needs to be done by when? D.K.

--other?

Money - scholarships? How much would reps be willing to fund? We'd like $200 D.G. will be responsible - P.F. thinks no one gets in free.

Related to agenda: Written materials prepared - M.F., D.K., B.B.

Put scenarios together (B.M. DNE buys, M.F. cooperative corp., P.F. with D.K. helping)

Child care - no space at Earth Dance for kids - if you want to come and need child care call (617) 576-1620 and we will figure it out. Another Place? Early registration so we know if we have to move from Earth Dance and whether we need to hire a baby-sitter, etc.

g) next CSC meeting(s) [10 min]

Photos of Kinderland is not necessary at Boston weekend. Thumbs up or Bill McCarthy will visit or forget it. Who would be able to come together at Boston weekend. Margaret could if doesn't conflict with other things. 6:45-8:15 warm up time after dinner before performance. We will meet during this time Sat Nov 8 at Kennedy School in Cambridge.

Dec. 20 in VT at Dena's 12 Noon. Putney dance Sat night. Can stay at Dena's Sat night but it might appear in Alphonse's new community news column. <grin>

Closing Circle [10 min]

Last modified: Marcy 10, 1998